Reptile Forum, Reptile Classifieds - CaptiveBred

[Jas]

"I know its not a dwarf but"... Does anyone know anything of the nesting habits of the peacock monitor, or which kind of nest box would be suitable for them?

[AS]

What makes you say that peacocks are not dwarfs, they belong to the sub genera odatria, and in my experience they are smaller than timorensis. As far as nesting goes why use a nestbox? The whole cage substrate should be one big nesting area. As far as auffenbergi specifically, go for a mix of humus and topssoil, humus has high biological activity and this encourages nesting behaviour, a good source is alaskabountea.com (although shipping is expensive.) Many people will tell you that monitors are tied to areas of poor soil quality(and this is true for aridland species, particularly Australian odatria) but I keep all my Indonesian monitors on the above mix (with various additions depending on the species) and they nest beautifully. You might also think about some piles of leaf litter for added security
Thanks, AS

[Jas]

Cheers AS, I might try that, as for the dwarf bit, it was meant to be a joke.

[arborgoanna]

Being that the Timor-complex typically comes from dense, tropical forested areas that generally see high amounts of rainfall per annum, I would tend to think that nesting in the ground would not be feasible for most reptile species. In such areas, the ground is often completely saturated for most of the year, and is prone to seasonal flooding during the monsoonal season. I would tend to believe that nesting in this species occurs off the ground, up in tree cavities, arboreal termitaria, or in epiphytic plant stands, much like what is seen in most other lizards from the area, including other varanids, agamids, and gekonids.

There are two published papers that I am aware of which document the captive breeding of V. timorensis (which I would think wouldn't vary much from V. auffenbergi). In both papers, I believe nesting occurred in elevated nestboxes, similar to that reported for V. prasinus complex breedings, if I am not mistaken.

The two papers that know of are:

Lambertz, K. 1995. Haltung und Zucht des Timorwarans (Varanus (Odatria) timorensis Gray, 1831) mit verschiedenen Zuchtgruppen. Monitor 4(1): 30-38.

Chippindale, P. (1991). Captive breeding of the Timor monitor (Varanus timorensis similis). Herp. Review, 22(2), 52-53.

Personally, if I were to set up nesting conditions for them, I would provide leaf litter on the floor- in case they do nest on the floor, however I would also include some arboreal nesting boxes filled with moist, organic media; much like the humus and decaying plant matter, which is most often associated with arboreal nesting situations.

Good luck!

[johne.ev]

Hi
AS , could you explain what you mean by HUMUS. if you were to buy it in a bag, what would you ask for? i did read the link but didn't mean much to me. i currently keep my young argus on 50/50 mix of play sand & topsoil, what would you recomend?

[Jas]

This is exactly what i was after, i was unsure as to weither they nest above or below ground, as there is little information to be found on them, i didnt want to go to the trouble of fitting a large high up nest box to the outside of the viv if she wasnt going to use it.The only reason im asking is that she has got progresivly larger lately and her behaviour has changed in the last week, she is basking more and i also noticed her with her stomach laying in the water bowl as if cooling the eggs, of course it may be she is just Fat! but it doesnt hurt to be prepared.They are still both extremely shy but the doors to there viv are wooden and so i can watch them through a small spy hole without disturbing them.Thanks to both of you for your input.
Jas

[AS]

Sorry Jas, I'm in the middle of my exams, so I am somewhat drained mentally, far too frazzled to get the joke, sorry!
Arborgoanna, I am aware of the papers you mention and I was very surprised to read them after my timors had nested on the ground for the first time, guess they just don't know how to behave properly
I noticed a tendency for them to lay right under the piles of cork bark in the enclosure, but it was always on the ground, and they had the option of going arboreal. Go figure!
Humus is decomposing plant matter, it is a very rare commodity as chemical fertilizers and pesticides have all but destroyed the beneficial microbes in the soil. I don't really know of a suitable source direct from the UK. What you need is a good culture of the beneficials in the soil, have you tried the art of keeping snakes by de vosjoli it provides a useful starting guide for maintaining healthy bio active substrate, although his method of stirring the substrate is not suitable for monitors(what with the burrows) There is also an American company terra 5 designs or terra 5 systems (cant remember which) and they have maintained lizard species and not just snakes in this type of system. I should mention I only use this setup with Indonesian species, like I said before other monitors seem to be allied to areas of lower soil fertility.
As far as Argus go they are one of the few species (along with tristis tristis) that I think are perfectly suited to the mix you mention (its not a bad mix for others, just better things out there if you look)
Argus are associated with hard, mesic soils so if you did want to make a change I would suggest maybe incorporating some loam or maybe even some type of clay. Just a suggestion though, I am sure you know what is best for your animals
Thanks, AS

[Sean]

Not kept auffenbergi but have kept something similar in similis I found them quite tricky and shy although when I obtained mine, my animals were quite old in monitor terms and were probably past the breeding stage. Anyway I understand similis is now part of the scalaris complex which are similar to the timorensis complex. You might be best off asking Bernd Eidenmuller as he is regarded as an odatria specialist, also there is Terry Thatcher who may have bred this species in the UK and there was also another chap called Dave Brenan who had success with auffenbergi quite some years back.

[johne.ev]

thanks , AS.

[AS]

I think in my last post I should have gone into more detail about my actual setup. I was not being dismissive of the idea that timorensis complex lay above ground, it's just that mine never did. A recent conversation on another forum about the way I keep my uroplatus, has given me a knew appreciation for the importance of environmental choice, not just the acceptable parameters laid out in the various husbandry manuals, but real wide ranging choice.
I kept my timorensis, auffenbergi and mystery monitors (was told they were scalaris of German origin but never verified this) in cages 8x4 foot by 5 foot tall per pair. The walls were covered with cork tiles and the substrate was 18 inches of humus/topsoil mix. A 100 ReptileUV self ballasted bulb provided a basking spot of 160 over a pile of stones (like a Retes stack) and a tubular heater maintained a warm end temp of 86, grading down to 75 on the cool side. T5 fluorescent provided general illumination for 14 hours per day and an ultrasonic humidifier on the warm end allowed for a humidity gradient of 60-80%. There were myriad branches in the cage and cork flats on the floor, piled up to provide hiding. On top of this I ran cork tubes from the substrate upto the ceiling with a hole about half way up, the tubes were filled with more humus up to just beneath the entrance hole, these were the above ground nesting facilities that I mentioned. There was a 2x1 foot water bowl and the substrate was watered every ten days with a mix of heterotrophic bacteria and silk foliage was sprayed every few days for drinking water. The general setup was moist rocky woodland. The monitors used every inch of this habitat, but the years they bred for me they always laid at the base of branches just under the substrate.
Still the most important thing is choice, and I really should have been clearer, I wasn't saying neglect the idea of arboreal laying, it was more about providing a greater number of options than a nest box would allow for (even though I used to use a nest box myself when I first started out.)
Thanks, AS