Reptile Forum, Reptile Classifieds - CaptiveBred

[T.Exeter]

Dan
There is an add on kingsnake now for $1450.00 each and they are bright yellow.
That crash is nothing compared to the royal crash just around the corner.

[snakesalive]

he isnt a kaff im afraid taban....

just a chondro that thinks he is a banana

k
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snakes...who would keep um...i dont know

[T.Exeter]

Sorry Karl
Didn't look at the picture or read your post properly.
Need to keep my eyes open.
I was having trouble posting last night,Time wise.
Seemed to take an age for things to down load.
Anyone else experiance this.

[JStroud]

Last night was slightly slow for me as well for some reason?? But it never is normally, just as fast as usual this morning. Are you on broadband?

[Scott W]

[JStroud]

The thing is spiders being co-dom are coming out left right and centre, so I've been thinking they were gonna crash for ages...was actually talking to a friend about it a couple of months ago. Do you think it includes other morphs as well?

[T.Exeter]

This will not be restricted too dominant or co-dominant morphs.
Recessive will take longer too drop,but it will get there.
Peter Khal proved out the piebald genes in 98,the first hets were for sale in late 99 and cost $20,000.00 pr.
In the states you can pick these up for $1400.00pr now,that is a 93% loss in 6 years.
The Albino has fared better,original price in 93 $7500.00.
If you look at the prices in america,you will have a better overview of what is happening.

I can get from the states today,albeit from a wholesaler the following.
Albino royals $1500.00
Pastel $350.00 males
These are the easy morphs to check.
There are huge set ups in the states and breeders with over 500 balls are not a rarity.
I know of one guy who has well over 100 female het albinos ready to go this year and an small army of albino males to service them.
The problem has been created by the initial success of the ball.or should i say a downfall of its own success.
If you have followed KS like i have for 5+years then you would have noticed the explosion of adverts in the ball section.
Last season was just a small sample of this breeding season.
All the big breeders trying to protect there investmant by sticking to prices.
Look at Ralph and Peter on the piebalds,there prices actually rose,but now look at the available pages. Still loads of pieds for sale on Khals.
There are big breeders who move there animals to europe at back door prices.I have been offered by a big name lesser platinums at $12000.00.
Thats close to 50% of market value.
Now when this season finishes there will be thousands of balls for sale in the states,and thats when they will hit europe.
Europe will not be able to cope with the extra US snakes let alone what we breed this year.
Why do you think Bell brings these animals to Hamm,it's not because he likes us,it's because they can't move them in the states.
I have a freind in italy who shifted 20 mohave this season,and some guys here purchased some. Next season they will be half of there value.
On the spiders,they lost 50% of there value in one season.
It's frightening realy,because i like so many others have spent tens of thousands of pounds setting up high end collections only to see forces outside of our control de-value them.
Some of us will make it,but many of us will fail,as there is only so much supply and demand one speicies can offer.
I have moved my own goal posts now and have shifted away from balls.
I still have over 120,but my main interest are now High end boas,high end pythons and And some rarer geckos.
Sometimes i feel that the market is not in the expensive morphs at all.
When you can produce and sell albinos for £500.00 then maybe you will not be able to produce enough.

But to end,i sincerly hope that all the guys who have invested heavily, as i have, will have some form of reward at the end.

[Stuart]

I'm sure a lot of people share your sentiments mate.

[Scott W]

Thanks Taben,

I guess the bottom line for someone breeding these snakes is what is the lowest value they would feel happy with for their efforts and investment.

I have kept out of the ball 'craze', I was worried that far too many hets had been produced too quickly, this will lead to 'lucky' breeders who can almost afford to give the snake away, rather than an 'investment' breeder who needs a return on his outlay. I do beleive that there is a good profit to be made with ball pythons but I do think it's gonna be hard.

I bought a large group of monitors last season, I knew the price would drop (down 50% in one year!) but I had taken this into account and was still happy with what I had bought, infact I had based my decision on the selling price being just £100 (down from £700). I'm hoping to breed mine before the market hits £100, and I don't think it will hit £100 for another year or so.
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Please DO NOT pm orders for reptiles, send email instead scott@captivebred.co.uk

[T.Exeter]

Scott
I agree with you 100%
I have made purchases that i know will drop and have so,and like you when they have produced i have enough to cover initail stock outlay and still have the adults. Thats business.
I am not bitter about the market,just trying to offer a differant view.
Anyone thinking about getting out of balls would be mad.
They are here to stay and double,triple and quadruple hets are not far away.
I just made a decision to cut down my ball projects and introduce more variaty for me.
I was getting through 250 rats a week,the time i spent in the rodent barn,was usually more then i spent on the collection.